Well, after reading about some of your problems with Vista Jim, and from reading that article above I can only say that I'm quite looking forward to getting my hands on a copy and lashing it on a machine. I work for a living as a computer engineer and I've gotta say as sad as it may sound I really love my job. Been messing around with computers since the good old rubber door stop spectrum 48k's, and ever since then I've been hooked. Now I know that everybody hates Bill Gates, and I know that everybody hates his software, and I know that everything he does will piss off just about everyone that owns a pc that runs windows. I personally think that up to windows XP his team of programmers have had a lot to answer for with the amount of holes and flaws they have released in their software, and about 90% of the time its a security flaw, so straight away they look like plonkers for releasing something that could put the end users data or identity in jeopardy. But as often as I hear people say, or as often as I say that Microsoft or Bill Gates is a waste of space I do have to take a step back and consider the fact that for all their faults they are largely responsible for pushing the computer market to where it is today, Just like Clive Sinclair did when he first realeased the spectrum computer. OK I know he went a bit mad and came up with those little wheeled thingys to zip you about town, but even so he was instrumental in bringing computers to the home at an affordable price. The point I'm trying to make is that although we all feel disgruntled towards what we perceive as Microsofts often lapse approach to the security of their software, just rest assured in the fact that(and I'm going out on a limb here) none of us here has ever written anything on the scale as microsoft windows, but we have all found bugs in our code at some point or another so we are all capable of making mistakes. And of course you've always got windows update when things are found to be doing things they shouldn't. Imagine what we'd be like if Microsoft released something and did nothing to patch it afterwards. Hell on earth is all I can think of. Anyway I've rambled for to long, and I've actually said something positive about microsoft which is something that I didn't think I could do..... So after I've swallowed a gallon of fairy liquid and presumably vomited a few times I'll be back......